Pastors: Casting Out Devils

[dawgs10]

Ron

I have no problem with being tired of the junk. We should all be. What I am taking issue with is someone who is demanding scriptural adhearane from everybody but himself. Yes we need to cry for accountability and demand it. But for a brother to belittle minister's the way.that has been done is just as wrong. To demand perfection and not be held accountable to operating in the fruit of the spirit is a bit more than just a little hypocritical. IMHO
DJ

But that's just it Pastor Don. I am countering ministers with the same measure they measured unto me during my formative years.

Hard. Inflexible. Merciless.

The Sword cuts both ways. If it cuts against the "wordliness" of those struggling to do right it bites sharply those who are sloppy and groundless in what they preach.

I am not afraid to wield it, as it was wielded against me.

so you admit that this is personal issue and you are debating everthing that comes down the pipe because someone hurt your feelings when you were a kid? maybe its time to grow up a little yourself if this is the case!! but i would agree with pastor don. i would say that you have to worship in spirit and truth and it seems that your "hard, inflexible, and meciless way of getting even is not the right spirit regardless of the truth as you know it.

[Gerald Creasy]

so you admit that this is personal issue and you are debating everthing that comes down the pipe because someone hurt your feelings when you were a kid? maybe its time to grow up a little yourself if this is the case!! but i would agree with pastor don. i would say that you have to worship in spirit and truth and it seems that your "hard, inflexible, and meciless way of getting even is not the right spirit regardless of the truth as you know it.

Nothing of the sort.

You are reading too much into what I said.

I will not be intimidated by anyone, I will no longer kowtow or kiss keister simply because someone is a pulpit blusterer.

[paul]

Also on that note, how many people has anyone here seen or prayed over to cast a demon out of, when it was more than likely (unintentionally) giving them an excuse for their bad behavior instead of holding them accountable?

If you have ever been around the real thing. you would know the difference. I quarentee it. It is not some behavioral problem

[pastorables]

But by golly it'll be preached in Miss-uh-ssippi as gospel wont it???

Gerald,

If this remark is directed to me or my grandmother, that's acceptable in this context. Any other implication is condescending and offensive. Please consider clarifying your intent with this question.

Thanks,
pa

[kurt73]

If demonic spirits can look like people (ghost) what keeps them from taking a form of a animal?

I have seen a person crawl like a snake on the floor when the Evangelist was casting out the demon.

Regradless if they can or not make sure you are right with God before you go casting demon outs. I often wonder how Priest do it in the Catholic religion?

I have seen a man stalk around a sanctuary with his arm coiled like a snake hissing.......but of course he was an old "saint" so somehow everyone reconciled this behavior as being "the Holy Spirit".

I'd use the eye roll emoticon but it'd really trivialize the disgust.

Where does the Bible say that a demon can appear as a person or a ghost?

I have also seen birthing in services, what a joke but yet thousand claim it is from God. There is a lot of false spirits out there and I thank God for Holy Ghost helping me in knowing what is real or fake. I do not need MAN to show or tell me. Let all MEN be liars and the WORD the truth! Now with that said what happens if God does something that is not in the bible to back it up like you keep claiming? Do we not let the Holy Ghost discern what is right or wrong?

But that's just it Pastor Don. I am countering ministers with the same measure they measured unto me during my formative years.

Hard. Inflexible. Merciless.

The Sword cuts both ways. If it cuts against the "wordliness" of those struggling to do right it bites sharply those who are sloppy and groundless in what they preach.

I am not afraid to wield it, as it was wielded against me.

All read here is "an eye for a eye and tooth for a tooth" Bondage like the law. Your comments are uncalled for, all do you is tear people down, demanding scripture in which you never use and claim everyone is stupid with your comments. Many have given you scripture to back up there thoughts but yet you have not provided any to disagree or discredit the scripture being used. One thing is for sure, you lack what Jesus shows us, Love, understanding, and being able to teach with gentleness. I'll be praying for you because I know deep down you are really trying to help.

[EagerBeaver]

Also on that note, how many people has anyone here seen or prayed over to cast a demon out of, when it was more than likely (unintentionally) giving them an excuse for their bad behavior instead of holding them accountable?

If you have ever been around the real thing. you would know the difference. I quarentee it. It is not some behavioral problem

I know...I've been around both.

I have seen people legitimately possessed by demons and the Holy Spirit had warned me and quickened by spirit to pray for strength of our spirits and for deliverance of the afflicted.

However I have also seen behavioral problems with some of my friends while I was growing up that were categorized as demonic activity. Yeah we all had rebellious streaks but no reason to pin the people to the floor and work on them for hours on end.

[oletimer]

paul Posted:

EagerBeaver wrote:

Also on that note, how many people has anyone here seen or prayed over to cast a demon out of, when it was more than likely (unintentionally) giving them an excuse for their bad behavior instead of holding them accountable?

If you have ever been around the real thing. you would know the difference. I quarentee it. It is not some behavioral problem

I agree Paul, untill you being there then it hard to imagine what it is like to see some one total consume by some else that is not them. To hear it talk and know with out a doult that no human could talk like that. To Feel the evil of its spirit, the contexts of its language, and its voice. I want never forget the voice. Oh yes the lying spirit that went with it.

To those that doult, pray that you never experience an encounter with such an experience.

I believe that Paul will agree that in the so call 3rd world countries your chances of running into one of these cases will increase.

The Devil had not changed with the years except to be wiser and more deceitfull then ever before as he deals with more wiser and knowledgeable people.

[Gerald Creasy]

But by golly it'll be preached in Miss-uh-ssippi as gospel wont it???

Gerald,

If this remark is directed to me or my grandmother, that's acceptable in this context. Any other implication is condescending and offensive. Please consider clarifying your intent with this question.

Thanks,
pa

Allow me to clarify:

When you preach your series on spiritual warfare and you preach a hearsay story you ARE NOT preaching the Gospel but ignorant superstition and hearsay.

The question is a question of your integrity: Will you teach ignorant hick hearsay as gospel??

I think I've interacted enough with you to know you WILL and prop it up with the flimsiest prooftext possible.

[Gerald Creasy]

All read here is "an eye for a eye and tooth for a tooth" Bondage like the law. Your comments are uncalled for, all do you is tear people down, demanding scripture in which you never use and claim everyone is stupid with your comments. Many have given you scripture to back up there thoughts but yet you have not provided any to disagree or discredit the scripture being used. One thing is for sure, you lack what Jesus shows us, Love, understanding, and being able to teach with gentleness. I'll be praying for you because I know deep down you are really trying to help.

Ahh yes, The prayers of the self righteous to be more as they are.

It is absolute love to say "Quit superstition. Quit making your devils more powerful. Quit appealing to the Power of the Holy Spirit to prove the power of Satan. Quit defending the power of the devil while sitting flaccid and phlegmatic when Pentecostal windbags assault the nature of God and you dont blink an eye.

No one has given a scripture in any shape that says a demon can ASSUME the shape of a cat.

It is not found in scripture.

Don't be a fool and believe it.

[pastorables]

Allow me to clarify:

When you preach your series on spiritual warfare and you preach a hearsay story you ARE NOT preaching the Gospel but ignorant superstition and hearsay.

The question is a question of your integrity: Will you teach ignorant hick hearsay as gospel??

I think I've interacted enough with you to know you WILL and prop it up with the flimsiest prooftext possible.

The God who anoints me to preach will judge my sermons.

I didn't read the remark as toward myself only. It sounded like a slam against Mississippi, especially with your purposed miss-spelling and all.

Now you call my grandmother a hick? I take offense to that, Gerald. Do you have no chivalry whatsoever?

pa

[Dr. Ron]

Scooter....I stand corrected except for the fact (and I should have noted such) my emphasis....word.....The word is God's word.....

Anyway, I thank you for any others who may not have not caught this....

[pastorables]

Quit defending the power of the devil while sitting

No one has given a scripture in any shape that says a demon can ASSUME the shape of a cat.

Gerald,

You have bought the lie that Satan has sold the body of Christ for years - that he is a powerless wimp. That's what he wants you to believe. This isn't biblical. To the contrary, the early church preached consistently and fervently of Satan's power. You've heard the old line, "I don't want to give the devil any glory by talking about his power"... That's rubbish. The ministry in the Bible were relentless in briefing the believers and young ministry concerning Satan's warfare and tactics. They didn't see it as glorification, they saw it as exposing and being prepared for the enemy.

As for the cat (only half was visible, btw), I have showed you scripture where certain devils were in the form of frogs, even using Matthew Henry, and you've totally disregarded the reference since it comes from the Revelation, a book which you often refuse to accept as proof text (citing that it's too emblematic). Furthermore, you resort to "holier than thou" name calling, even when experiences can be validated with scripture. Unfortunately, I often cease my discussions with you due to this very type of interaction.

Finally, I've was never told that all of life's spiritual anomalies must pass the "Gerald filter", so give me some slack.

pa

[Pastor Don]

Gerald said:

"But that's just it Pastor Don. I am countering ministers with the same measure they measured unto me during my formative years.

Hard. Inflexible. Merciless.

The Sword cuts both ways. If it cuts against the "wordliness" of those struggling to do right it bites sharply those who are sloppy and groundless in what they preach.

I am not afraid to wield it, as it was wielded against me".


Gerald I do understand where you are coming from. You are talking to a man who hated preachers. Not just one of them but all of them. I saw ministers as nothing but a man who was too lazy or some form of disability and could not or would not work at a steady job. I took my example from my own father. A man who truly made a mockery of the ministry of the Gospel. Not in the same way you saw because he would NEVER even think of being too hard on a member because they paid their tithes. Me on the other hand. No such reprieve. When I backslide at the age of 12 I determined then that I would do all I could to expose the whole lot of them.

Then I met men like J.E. Brisson, A.J. Coalter, Charles Hawkins, and a fairly unknown man by the name of Bill Clarke from Alabama. I saw in these men the fruit of the spirit. You know things like love, long suffering, gentleness, goodness, meekness. When they demonstrated those kinds of things I sat up and took notice.

The Word does tell us that there will be tares among us and we all read that, but does it say NOT to RIP them up because in doing so we will cause destruction to the harvest?

Gerald, I applaud your desire to hold the ministry accountable. We need men and women that will do so. But you my friend paint with a VERY broad brush.

As for citing examples I will not use anyone but myself. When I was about 9 maybe 10 years old I was at a revival in Burnsville, NC. I wish I could remember who was preaching but I can't. But I do know what I saw. There was an elderly lady from the community who tormented the church. Complaining about everything. It was on a Thursday night in the basement of the church (that is where the services were being held).
When the minister encountered the demon he was very firm. The demon spoke to him several times. Argued even. But the evil spirit did not prevail. When the demon left the individual there was an appearance of a form. It was somewhat man like but very small. It had no distinguishable features other than it moved like a mist. The shrill that came from it was like something I have never heard since. It left through an open door.

Now if I read you post correctly you will label me with Todd Bently and other heiritics because I have seen a manifestation of a demon and it does not fit your understanding. But I know what I saw and friend you can call me a hick or anything else you desire but it does not change the truth. It did happen.

Gerald please don't let way you were done cause you to treat others that way. You can stand for the truth and I would gladly stand with you but you must hold yourself as accountable as you would others. You are so narrow sighted to exposing the hearsay in others that you are blind to not operating in fruit of the Spirit.

I do love you friend and I am not trying to down you, in fact I admire the fact that you are willing to stand for the truth and call black, black and white, white sin, sin. But there has been enough innocent people hurt by so called people of God being hurtful and mean spirited. It is a plea Brother from my heart. The fruit of the Spirit is what will win the lost, it is what caused the early church to flourish. When they saw the love they had. Please just think about it. I know this is hijacking the original intent of the thread but this is something I fell passionately about.

DJ[i]

[kurt73]

All read here is "an eye for a eye and tooth for a tooth" Bondage like the law. Your comments are uncalled for, all do you is tear people down, demanding scripture in which you never use and claim everyone is stupid with your comments. Many have given you scripture to back up there thoughts but yet you have not provided any to disagree or discredit the scripture being used. One thing is for sure, you lack what Jesus shows us, Love, understanding, and being able to teach with gentleness. I'll be praying for you because I know deep down you are really trying to help.

Ahh yes, The prayers of the self righteous to be more as they are.

It is absolute love to say "Quit superstition. Quit making your devils more powerful. Quit appealing to the Power of the Holy Spirit to prove the power of Satan. Quit defending the power of the devil while sitting flaccid and phlegmatic when Pentecostal windbags assault the nature of God and you dont blink an eye.

No one has given a scripture in any shape that says a demon can ASSUME the shape of a cat.

It is not found in scripture.

Don't be a fool and believe it.

That is the most childish thing I ever heard you say "No one has given a scripture in any shape that says a demon can ASSUME the shape of a cat" That is something my 8yr old would say. Come on my friend, stop grasping for straws.

Plus show me in the bible where it can not happen?

[scooter]

Scooter....I stand corrected except for the fact (and I should have noted such) my emphasis....word.....The word is God's word.....

Anyway, I thank you for any others who may not have not caught this....

Response: No problem. I see "God" as true in an infinite fashion.

The written "Word of God" is finite textually.

I was addressing the issue of "If it didn't happen in the Bible it couldn't happen."

I believe Paul's context of what I think is David was speaking more of the personal experience with God, what God has said to ones heart, being true rather than only the written "word".

For example if the Holy Spirit placed an unction in me to do something that my fellows attempted to keep me from I would choose God's truth, which comes in personal revelation.

Is God's Word spoken to my heart God's word even though it may not be a Biblical passage?

I will boldly say yes.

Knowing the voice of the Shepherd and His personal touch transcends the text only approach.

The best examples we have in the NT of Christianity didn't have the NT.